“Isn’t it an interesting world we’re currently living in?” With that question, Vici Properties CEO Edward Pitoniak led off the real estate investment trust’s (REIT) third-quarter earnings call. He was speaking specifically of recent interest-rate cuts by the Federal Reserve and their consequent effect on dealmaking.
Pitoniak opined that the Fed’s cuts had created “a period of uncertainty that has been quite nauseating,” leading to volatility that he hopes will soon pass. “A lot of people on both sides of the transaction table are trying to figure out where the hell we are.”
Pitoniak was asked whether that volatility wouldn’t be conducive to dealmaking. He replied, “We’ve got a lot of lines in the water on the dealmaking side.” But he added, much week-to-week uncertainty in the capital markets put them “in a state of flux and volatility that has made decision making more difficult.”
The CEO noted that Vici’s stock price had seesawed over a “really tumultuous summer. We have to recognize and believe that things will come down.” Fortunately, added CFO John Payne, “Consumer economic conditions are quite good.”
As for the imminent United States elections, Payne acknowledged that new casinos were being voted on in Missouri, Arkansas, and Virginia. Still, “It’s actually quite quiet for gaming.”
Pitoniak’s comments on volatility were part of a lengthy and philosophical prologue to the actual third-quarter results. Assembled Wall Street analysts spent little time on those results, mostly asking questions about Vici’s future.
Payne said, “Casino gaming will continue to be a major driver of our group.” He believes in continued Las Vegas tailwinds, citing Barry Diller’s recent bullishness on experiential real estate, as well as the critical mass of sports infrastructure at the south end of the Las Vegas Strip.
Queried about Caesars Entertainment’s sale of the Linq Promenade and Vegas High Roller, announced earlier this week, Vici executives stressed that they don’t hold an option on that real estate. Regarding its effect on 26 Vici-owned acres of raw land nearby, Pitoniak said the Promenade was a potentially powerful corridor to that acreage, near Caesars Forum Convention Center.
“Recovering operator” Payne urged his listeners to pay attention to the recent performances of Caesars and MGM Resorts International, major tenants of Vici. He noted that MGM is seeing 94 percent hotel occupancy in the fourth quarter and that average daily rates are moving upward.
“Long-term, F1’s great for the city,” he continued. “Is it down a tiny bit from last year? We’ll have to wait and see. We feel really good about Las Vegas,” Payne added, cautioning analysts against taking a casino company’s fiscal temperature every 90 days.
As for possible deals in the Las Vegas locals market, Payne responded, “We’ve been spending years meeting with operators,” both in downtown Las Vegas and regionally. “It’s definitely been a focus for me and my team. There are some neat places we would love to be partners in.”
Pitoniak warned against getting overexposed in potentially saturated markets, citing Illinois and Indiana, and asking, “When is enough enough?” Payne interjected that the expansion of historical horse racing devices and slot routes is a cause for caution. He confessed that he never would have thought Virginia, Nebraska, and Kentucky would have gambling “at the magnitude that they do now.”
Overall, casino operators were said to be seeing continued low-end softness among customers, but are still thinking about asset growth, mostly of an expansion nature. “Hopefully, that leads to growth for us,” Payne said.
Vici leadership chose its words carefully when asked about possible REIT deals in Indian Country. “We’ve developed very powerful positive relationships,” Pitoniak said. He continued that Vici has had business with tribes in off-reservation projects, but that it’s “problematic” to do the same on tribal reservations, fraught with risk and idiosyncrasy.
He explained that he isn’t drawn to “sandwich lease” situations, in which Vici can neither own the underlying real estate nor run the tribal casino. Added Payne, “We’re still coming up the learning curve when it comes to understanding the risks associated with that [tribal] structure. We’re not at a point where we can say the code has been cracked.”
What kind of deals are coming, big or small? “It’s something we think about every day,” Pitoniak replied, explaining that Vici’s strategy involves tradeoffs and gaming is “not a category that doesn’t have an endless stream of marketed processes.”
Pitoniak said Vici had some deals in the offing, “including some bigger assets in gaming. We have to accept the tradeoff that our deal flow will be sporadic.”
Some of those deals may be of a non-gaming nature, even in Las Vegas. Pitoniak disclosed that Vici is in discussion with former Major League Baseball player José Bautista about a venue for the Las Vegas Lights soccer team.
Payne added that many of the casino operators are by nature entrepreneurs, with fingers in many non-gaming assets. He was, however, noncommittal as to specific projects.
